Looking at Wyoming and Idaho.

[ec-10]

Hello all. I just recently heard about the FSW project and have been giving it a look. I was registered on the original FSP website but lost interest after the vote. I have lived in southwest Missouri most of my life and am pretty well sick of it. I am part of the gun culture.  I have recently taken interest in bolt action rifles and would like to be able to practice at distances of greater then 100 yards. That leaves the handful of ranges in this area coming up short.  I love the concept of being able to open carry a sidearm in public without being hassled. Missouri is an open carry state but due to people's ignorance walking down the street with a sidearm would most likely get you tasered. I am looking to relocate to either Idaho or Wyoming due to the large amounts of public land and lower population density. When I ride my motorcycle I like to see wide open spaces not yet another shopping center.

I have a few questions that may make me seem like a nut-job but I assure you I am not trolling. I am looking for genuine answers. I downloaded the Wyoming Comprehensive Annual Finacial Report for FY 2005 from the state auditor's (Max Maxfield) website here:http://sao.state.wy.us/. One of the component units listed on the report is the Wyoming Community Development Autority. It would appear to me that the WCDA holds around $693 million dollars worth of mortgages in the state. Can somebody give me the cliff notes version of this department? As a person on the lower end of the income totem pole would I be required to participate in this program to purchase a home in Wyoming (is it law? do banks push for people to use it?) or can I seek out my own financing?

Another component unit that caught my eye on the report was the Department of Transportation with $5.2 billion in total net assets.
For the DOT they list Taxes Reciveable as $0, due from Primary Government as $23 million and due from Other Governments as $16.1 million. My questions are: What kind of road taxes do you pay in Wyoming? Are these "Other Governments" surrounding states (or is this federal highway funds)? Are there any toll roads currently in Wyoming or any planned? And slightly related to this topic, what is involved in registering a vehicle in Wyoming? What fees have to be paid? Do you have to get an emissions test done? In Missouri we have to pay personal property tax on vehicles every year. To renew a licence plate we have to show the personal property receipt, proof of insurance and a state inspection.

As far as land ownership goes, does anybody know what year Wyoming stopped allowing land to be held in allodial title, or did they ever allow it? And lastly, do most cities florinate the water?

[manfromnevada]

Welcome EC!!!
I don't live in WY (yet), but here's the website for the DMV:
http://www.dot.state.wy.us/Default.jsp?sCode=veh
That will show everything you need to know about vehicle registration. If it's like NV, part of the registration fee is based upon value and therefore is truly a personal property tax.

I don't believe there is any requirement to get lending thru some state sponsered program for a home. No way!

The rest of your questions will have to be answered by those more knowledgable than me. Give me another year!

Mac

[ec-10]

Thanks for the link. I'm glad at least one of the thirty odd people who have looked at this thread decided to reply.

Maybe I should have made my post shorter and more to the point. I do ramble on so.

Are there any toll roads in the state of Wyoming?

Has anybody had any dealings with the Wyoming Community Development Authority?

TIA

[MamaLiberty]

No toll roads that I know of. Most of us don't have anything more to do with any government "authority" than we can possibly get out of. I can't answer your other questions, but hope there are others here who will.

Actually, many may already be answered somewhere on this forum. If you put some of your questions into the search engine here, http://www.fundamentalsoffreedom.com/fswforum//index.php?action=search you might come up with at least some of them. Good luck. MamaLiberty


*FSW Forum Admin Note - Fixed link. *

[wyomiles]

Howdy ec-10, Welcome !  There is all sorts of info here so take your time and look around.
As to shooting , you will love it. Where I use to work we would sometimes stop on the way home to shoot,usually when someone had just purchased the latest, geatest firearm. We would drive into a canyon which was about 2 miles from work ,and about 50 yards off the highway, and start shooting.  In Wyoming there is a lot of public lands, or BLM lands. Many of the towns are surrounded by it. You can drive onto it on existing roads, usually dirt roads, and pull off in a spot with a good backdrop and shoot away. Wyoming has a thriving gun culture so most folks do this sort of thing. I always loved being able to jump in the car and drive a few miles and feel like I was the only person left in the world. Wyoming is a great place for biking.

I have never used the WCDA    http://www.naihc.net/NAIHC/files/ccLibraryFiles/Filename/000000000975/Wyoming.pdf

I think it is just a government program to help people get into a mortgage when they cant get financing any other way. You do not have to join this or any other program. There is still some freedom left in Wyoming. The banks may "push it" as there may be some insurance in it for them ? As you probobly are well aware people who make loans to others are taking a risk and like to have some piece of mind that you will pay them back. Due to the boom in Wyoming right now there are lots of jobs and lots of income to be made. My advise would be to get one of those jobs, save up a large down payment, and then the banks will feel better about financing you.  By the way what type of work do you do ? if you don't mind me asking.

I am sure we have threads elseware on car licence plates, let me see if I can find it .

Miles



Well here  is a place to look but not sure if it is here ?

http://www.fundamentalsoffreedom.com/fswforum//index.php?board=6.0

[ec-10]

Most of us don't have anything more to do with any government "authority" than we can possibly get out of.

Now there's an attitude I can get my mind around.

[Jared]

I have friends in town who purchased a home through that Community Dev deal.  From what I understand there was a bit of a hassle in terms of paperwork and work done on the house, like they had to repaint it before they could move in etc.
I just used standard financing on my house.

For vehicles, there is no emissions test or state inspection.  They do a visual VIN check but that is all.
On my '96 Nissan 4WD reg'd in May of this year: $69.32 for plates and registration + $9 for new title + $5 VIN inspection fee

[ec-10]

Howdy ec-10, Welcome !  There is all sorts of info here so take your time and look around.
As to shooting , you will love it. Where I use to work we would sometimes stop on the way home to shoot,usually when someone had just purchased the latest, greatest firearm. We would drive into a canyon which was about 2 miles from work ,and about 50 yards off the highway, and start shooting.  In Wyoming there is a lot of public lands, or BLM lands. Many of the towns are surrounded by it. You can drive onto it on existing roads, usually dirt roads, and pull off in a spot with a good backdrop and shoot away. Wyoming has a thriving gun culture so most folks do this sort of thing. I always loved being able to jump in the car and drive a few miles and feel like I was the only person left in the world. Wyoming is a great place for biking.

Howdy back. I'm reading all I can of this site. I think this site will answer most of my questions about WY. I am still looking at Idaho based mainly on terrain and climate. What bothers me about Idaho is there appears to be a lot of "federal" land. The shooting sounds great. Here in southwest Missouri the land is one "farm" after another or one house after another. There are plenty of large open places but they are all off limits unless you get permission from the land owner. Most land owners will have nothing to do with it. The largest part of the gun culture around here is the once a year dear hunters. I still get that "look" now and then when I go to the range with my AR-15.

I have never used the WCDA    http://www.naihc.net/NAIHC/files/ccLibraryFiles/Filename/000000000975/Wyoming.pdf
I think it is just a government program to help people get into a mortgage when they cant get financing any other way. You do not have to join this or any other program.

That's what I thought. Buying a house would be a ways down the road for me. I would actually rather buy a piece of land and go from there.

Due to the boom in Wyoming right now there are lots of jobs and lots of income to be made.

I like the sound of that.

 

By the way what type of work do you do ? if you don't mind me asking.

I am not a career man. I don't have the formal education for it. I have some trade school training in CAD but that's about it. The list of jobs I've had is pretty long. I've been fixing and modifying things since I was a child. I've built limos (welding, building interior structures, upholstery, wiring, etc) and currently modify vehicles for disabled people. I've worked in product development testing for an engineering department and also worked in automotive repair. I can build computer systems from off the shelf parts. I have designed and built data acquisition systems that use Labview software and components from National Instrument. I can weld/fabricate metal parts and have done some machining (I love doing custom machine work that is within my abilities). My automotive shop teacher (high school) said I should have gone into body work. I am really good at beating panels back into shape or forming new ones but it all goes to hell when the bondo comes out. 

My biggest problem in finding a new job is the growing tread that companies require a college degree for even the simplest of jobs. I know of one company that requires a college degree to work in their shipping department. I've seen their shipping department. These guys put labels on boxes and load trucks. WTF?

I know for a fact that I am going to have to start my own business again. I had an automotive glass shop for a short period. Man that was a good way to drain a bank account.

[ec-10]

I have friends in town who purchased a home through that Community Dev deal.  From what I understand there was a bit of a hassle in terms of paperwork and work done on the house, like they had to repaint it before they could move in etc.
I just used standard financing on my house.

Yeah, looks like I would avoid that deal entirely.

For vehicles, there is no emissions test or state inspection.  They do a visual VIN check but that is all.
On my '96 Nissan 4WD reg'd in May of this year: $69.32 for plates and registration + $9 for new title + $5 VIN inspection fee

That gives me something to go by. Thanks.

[Chris]

Hi ec,

I?m not there yet, but hope to be by next summer. Hope I can at least help a bit.

What kind of road taxes do you pay in Wyoming?

From my own research, road funding in WY is traditionally obtained from statewide vehicle registration fees, and state gasoline and severance taxes. Additionally, some part of property taxes can be utilized for transportation costs, this differs by county.

Are these "Other Governments" surrounding states (or is this federal highway funds)?

You?d likely have to call and ask WY DOT, but I believe that ?Primary Government? is the state gov, & ?other governments? are county governments (and possibly funds received from the feds.)

Are there any toll roads currently in Wyoming or any planned?

According to StateMaster.com , there are no existing ones. You'd have to ask Cheyenne whether they?re planning to implement any.

And slightly related to this topic, what is involved in registering a vehicle in Wyoming?

Like Jared mentioned, there are no emissions or state inspections required, just a visual VIN check, although the WY DMV site says proof of insurance is needed too.  (See ?How to Register your Car in Wyoming? from the WY DMV site.)

How much? Depends on the vehicle and the county. Some counties have fee calculators that will give an estimate of how much it?ll cost.

As far as land ownership goes, does anybody know what year Wyoming stopped allowing land to be held in allodial title, or did they ever allow it?

Depends on what you?re really trying to find out/accomplish. If it is to determine whether one can claim ?allodial title? to land to avoid property taxes or the threat of foreclosure/eminent domain, it doesn?t appear such a tactic will work. The word ?allodial? doesn?t appears in any Wyoming statute, and from tax cases I've come across, the dictionary definition of allodial (from either the common dictionary or Black?s Law Dictionary, 7th Edition (1999)) isn't sufficient to justify use of the term ?allodial title? to prevent property taxation, etc.

Nonetheless, I?m not a lawyer, so don?t rely on my answer. To learn specifics about the topic, I?d say to contact a lawyer in WY about it.

And lastly, do most cities florinate the water?

I can?t find exact cities, but the CDC reported in 2002 that 36.7% of the WY population was receiving fluoridated water.

Since such fluoridation is restricted to public water supplies, and about 30% of WY?s population lives in urban areas (i.e. - Casper and Cheyenne/Laramie) I suspect that most of the fluoridation is found in the bigger cities (over 15K or so), but you?d probably have to try and reach the State board of health for specifics.

I still get that ?look? now and then when I go to the range with my AR-15.

I hear ya man. I'm in NV, and while we have ranges up to 300 or 400 yards, even here I get that ?look? too when I take my FAL to the range.

 


Chris

[ec-10]

Thanks for the info Chris.

[havoc1969]

nice to see ya made it here EC!!

[Paul Bonneau]

You may be a nut-job, but you're welcome here among my fellow nut jobs. 

It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence.

-- Charles A. Beard

I'll just give you my big picture view of Wyoming. There is bad news and good news, having to do with the severance taxes. The state government gets a huge windfall of taxes from the coal and whatnot dug out of the ground, and another big humk in interest from earlier stuff dug out of the ground (permanent mineral fund). The good news is that taxes on citizens are generally pretty low. The bad news is that it buys a lot of government (2nd highest per capita government employment in the country). The good news is that government is not all that meddling - yet (partly because Wyoming is a small-town state, and bureaucrats cannot hide in anonymity).

There are lots of government programs, but if you are a moral person you can refrain from "taking advantage" of most of them. Toll roads are not bad if privately owned (like some examples in California), but there are none here. No parking meters either. People like the government land, of which there is a lot, but they might start to think it's not such a great deal when more and more restrictions on its use appear. For the moment it's not too bad though.

You can be pretty much left alone in Wyoming. Open carry of firearms is a very obvious example of that.

Idaho is fairly similar in a lot of ways, however it has one really large city (such tend to drive politics in a state) and the taxes are substantially higher. Also the tax structure is much better in Wyoming, as it is primarily a sales tax which makes for some resistance to tax hikes across the entire population. No income tax, which is better than most states where people who don't pay for it always vote to increase it on others who do. I think Idaho is a state with an income tax, but not sure. Sales tax in Wyoming ranges from 4% to 6%, depending on the county, and the tax above the 4% base always (I believe) has a sunset on it.

Wyoming is a little less likely to be "Californicated" than Idaho and Montana, I think.

Your jack-of-all-trades background will fit in very well in Wyoming. Very many people here are like that, and it's expected to a certain degree.

[ec-10]

nice to see ya made it here EC!!

Hey havoc.

[ec-10]

You may be a nut-job, but you're welcome here among my fellow nut jobs. 

It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence.

-- Charles A. Beard

I'll just give you my big picture view of Wyoming. There is bad news and good news, having to do with the severance taxes. The state government gets a huge windfall of taxes from the coal and whatnot dug out of the ground, and another big humk in interest from earlier stuff dug out of the ground (permanent mineral fund). The good news is that taxes on citizens are generally pretty low. The bad news is that it buys a lot of government (2nd highest per capita government employment in the country). The good news is that government is not all that meddling - yet (partly because Wyoming is a small-town state, and bureaucrats cannot hide in anonymity).

On the CAFR for 2005 it shows $0 for taxes recieveable under the governmental activities column and $11.1 million in the business activities column. I guess that is the sales tax (not sure). Any state that shows $0 taxes receivable in the governmental column is better than Missouri in my opinion.  Now they do show $6.9 billion in net assets for the state (both governmental and business) not including component units so I don't see the state going broke anytime soon. That should keep the need for an income tax at bay as well. This is a good thing, relatively speaking.

There are lots of government programs, but if you are a moral person you can refrain from "taking advantage" of most of them. Toll roads are not bad if privately owned (like some examples in California), but there are none here. No parking meters either. People like the government land, of which there is a lot, but they might start to think it's not such a great deal when more and more restrictions on its use appear. For the moment it's not too bad though.

I think the lower population density coupled with the attitude of that population should keep those restrictions to a minimum lest some politician turn up tared and feathered in the town square. 

You can be pretty much left alone in Wyoming. Open carry of firearms is a very obvious example of that.

I'm currently in the process of selling my Glock 17 (waiting for the buyer's purchase permit to go through  ). I think I will be getting a Ruger GP100 4" in .357. That will look much more pretty on my hip.

Idaho is fairly similar in a lot of ways, however it has one really large city (such tend to drive politics in a state) and the taxes are substantially higher. Also the tax structure is much better in Wyoming, as it is primarily a sales tax which makes for some resistance to tax hikes across the entire population. No income tax, which is better than most states where people who don't pay for it always vote to increase it on others who do. I think Idaho is a state with an income tax, but not sure. Sales tax in Wyoming ranges from 4% to 6%, depending on the county, and the tax above the 4% base always (I believe) has a sunset on it.

Wyoming is a little less likely to be "Californicated" than Idaho and Montana, I think.

If you all could figure out how to turn up the thermostat in Wyoming I probably wouldn't even consider Idaho. 

Your jack-of-all-trades background will fit in very well in Wyoming. Very many people here are like that, and it's expected to a certain degree.

Sounds good. I tend to think the opportunities for new small business are greater in Wyoming right now because of the energy boom. This is good.