inflation, gas prices and the rural economy in WY - group prep and defense?

[colonial shooter]

"And when the starving, screaming goblins come out of Denver (maybe even Cheyenne), looking for rape and pillage, it will be nice to be so far away..."

Being far away and isolated can also work to the advantage of the "goblins" in that they can, potentially, take their time to observe you, and invade when you are least expecting it and in creative, time-consuming ways.  Will there be somebody at the house to keep watch 24-7?  They will figure, rightly, that folks like us have fat larders that we can live alone far away and we will thus be tempting targets.  If and when they can get through your security, you have no recourse and they can set up shop.  This is what happened in Argentina, according to Ferfal, in the most brutal ways.

Also, are folks in Newcastle (& Hot Springs, and Rapid City) 100% prepared for hyperinflation?  There may be plenty of desperate people even there, maybe more percentage-wise, depending on how the economy there is impacted.  In Argentina, the collapse saw mass exodus from rural areas into cities.  This is the case throughout the third world too, where people leave their fields and plots for urban shanty towns, seeking better economic opportunity.   

So, you can't take for granted, that isolation will work to your advantage, it could be the reverse.  So I am suggesting that FSW folks plan living arrangements accordingly.  If you already have property that you are committed to, maybe you can add rooms or buildings, to accommodate other FSW members, such that you create a defensible micro community.  In any event, a collapse will probably make things much more difficult in rural areas too.     

The goblins are gonna have fun walking 150-200 miles to get to some of these locations

[Wyobob]

Besides who wants to be trapped in a town with 10K students from the school including engineering students, AG students, and ROTC? OR 5K unemployed miners?

[nurseJT]

Those are some of the reasons I would want to be at home when "the big one" (earthquake) hits Kalifornia.
Small town (1200 people), 120 miles from LA, close to USMC base Twentynine Palms, 10+ miles to nearest town across open desert, otherwise only one paved road runs through.
There is a steep, narrow, winding canyon between us and the nearest interstate.
If necessary, it wouldn't be too difficult to close down that road.

My place sits 1 mile back from the paved through road.
Beginning 2 neighbors to the north, it is 17 miles across open desert BLM land to the nearest private property.
A tough bugout, but a nice barrier.

Within 1/2 mile of me are:
at least 20 backhoes, tractors, etc. useful for clearing debris or erecting barricades - with associated fuel tanks,
at least 100 off road vehicles,
about 25 riding horses,
at least 20 private wells,
4 county wells,
LOTS of neighbors with backup power, radio communications, weapons & the will to fend off invaders.
A small group of us have made some plans for holding out in our neighborhood, and watching out for each other.

The biggest problem is that it is in Kalifornia.
No attempt to hijack the thread, just some of the things I've thought on the past decade.
Those are some of the things I intend to have around me where I go from now on out.
We are all on 5 acre lots here - close enough for shouting to work as communication with nearest neighbors, rapid response, overlapping fields of fire, etc.
I probably wouldn't recommend any more space between neighbors in a SHTF or TEOTWAKI scenario - just my 0.02 worth.

Take care,
nurseJT

[Crappiewy]

5 acres is too close. Very difficult to hold. You are better off in a housing tract. Even if you could hold it the gov would be there in no time from 29 plams and seize all your equipment and wells for of course the common good.

[nurseJT]

Even if you could hold it the gov would be there in no time from 29 plams and seize all your equipment and wells for of course the common good.

Mebbe so, but ... who would they give the equipment and water to?
I'm thinking all the heavy equipment operators are going to be too busy working to shuttle equip to other areas.
Those other areas all have large construction firms/projects with equipment onsite.

Lots of gov't controlled water already in this and other areas.
Why bother with private wells 30 miles from nearest large population center - that has an existing large water supply infrastructure?

Keep in mind this is the largest county in the USA - 20,052.5 square miles - and I live in a fairly isolated corner.
Or maybe I am keeping alive an Oath Keeper illusion in regards to the USMC at Twentynine Palms ....

Take care,
nurseJT

[Terence]

Why bother with private wells 30 miles from nearest large population center - that has an existing large water supply infrastructure?

Keep in mind this is the largest county in the USA - 20,052.5 square miles - and I live in a fairly isolated corner.

I know that area well, NurseJT. I used to fly all over that area on XC flights out of Van Nuys.

I always wondered. . . .how deep are those wells, out there?  600 Feet?

Just speculation, but I don't think people in L.A. (Or even Palm Springs) would think to flee to that area.
It's amazing how remote one can be over a short distance from a large population.

. . .Not that you wouldn't rather be in Wyoming . . .

Terence

[rhodges]

Even if you could hold it the gov would be there in no time from 29 plams and seize all your equipment and wells for of course the common good.

Mebbe so, but ... who would they give the equipment and water to?

My thought is that the recipient is not important to them, but taking the goods is.  Even if the goods go into a warehouse, rot, and are then tossed into the ocean.  It seems to me that one aspect of their tactics is (will be) to prevent people from being self-sufficient, even in small ways.  And one way to increase loyalty and dependence on the government would be to seize all goods whenever possible.  Or if seizing is not an option, then destroying them.

[MamaLiberty]

And one way to increase loyalty and dependence on the government would be to seize all goods whenever possible.  Or if seizing is not an option, then destroying them.

I know that's probably not how you meant it, but I'm wondering how taking and destroying things will increase loyalty... Sounds like a good reason to break out the .308 and ....

[Crappiewy]

Most of the disaster/war plans that Ive ever seen had "locate, Itemize and secure local resources" as one of the top 3 priorities of operation.

[rhodges]

I know that's probably not how you meant it, but I'm wondering how taking and destroying things will increase loyalty...

You are right.  I did not mean true loyalty, but either the forced loyalty that tyrants crave or a kind of Stockholm syndrome loyalty.

[nurseJT]

I know that area well, NurseJT. I used to fly all over that area on XC flights out of Van Nuys.

I always wondered. . . .how deep are those wells, out there?  600 Feet?

Just speculation, but I don't think people in L.A. (Or even Palm Springs) would think to flee to that area.
It's amazing how remote one can be over a short distance from a large population.

. . .Not that you wouldn't rather be in Wyoming . . .

Terence

A neighbor who headed the local water board for quite a few years told me water is only 140 feet down.
I haven't checked that against any other sources though.

Yep, around here we have miles and miles of nothing but  miles and miles.
Like with radiation sources, distance is your friend when between you and a big city. 

Still planning on moving to Wyoming this summer.
Still hoping for that middle school nurse job in Cody.
Looks like finding a place to rent in Cody is going to be tough.

Take care,
nurseJT

[Maol]

If you are a prepper with an isolated BOL I would recommend that you make preparations to receive company. Family, friends, and like minded folks that you meet with regularly and make friends with before TEOTWAWKI. Make space, and spend time with them to see if the group dynamics will work. You are going to have a tough time on your own. Prepare well, get several .308's or better. You need to be able shoot a long way in Wyoming. Better to get even longer shooters depending on your situ. 30-06s, .300mags, .338mags, .375/.408Cheytacs if you can afford it. a .50BMG if you can't. x54r Mosin Nagants (poor man's 30-06) can be had with sniper sights for $400, and Ammo is $225/1000. Post your land well. Make friends with your neighbors, get radios and use them with your neighbors. Make rabbit holes. Make Wolverine holes. Get night vision. Practice, Practice Practice. Think, Think, Think. When the Sh*t hits the fan you won't need gold or silver. Yer gonna need lead, veggies, and friends.

[archy]

In times when I let my mind wander, I too can't help but imagine something of a JWR "Patriots" scenario including a co-located retreat group with 24/7 guard shifts.  We (husband and I) are striving to be worthy of such a group, and have realized we have some work to do in terms of practical skill sets.

Think *doubling up* with a neighbor family or fellow FSWers in your area, maybe augmented if you have family members who might make it to where you are.

Some of my *family members* are located pretty far-distant: California, Canada, and East of the Missippi. But they mighg make it if things get bad in their neighborhood and decide to scoot.

Or, they might not make it. 

[Bret]

One thing I do not see mentioned in this thread, although it may have been in some of the associated links (I have not had time to go through them all) is martial law.  I am not a conspiracy theorist but I have observed history.  During Katrina martial law was imposed, the national guard did go door to door doing searches and confiscating all weapons.  In 2008 there were 2 divisions created to provide martial law/domestic service in the event of an "economic collapse".  Those units become fully operational in early 2012 (not saying they will be deployed just saying that is when they will be operational).

With that in mind spreading out the national guard resources and these 2 divisions of US Army (20k soldiers) only the larger metro areas can be placed under martial law.  It is possible to place check points at some major intersections in rural areas but largely rural areas will not have martial law, should it ever come to that.  This can be a blessing and a curse in an urban area.  During Katrina many were housed at the superdome arena but then the Red Cross was barred from providing food and water for fear even more would show up and toilets were literally the field as the stadium toilets were restricted and no portable toilets were provided (many news articles all say the same thing).

In a rural area this can keep the urbanites from spreading however it also means that resources will not be available for food drops, policing, etc.  You will literally have to be self sufficient if the problem is large enough that martial law gets imposed. 


Another thing I did not see mentioned was if you have resources do not advertise them.  Generators make noise, while noise fades in the distance it still can carry quite a bit and can attract people like moths to the flame.  Lights are visible from quite a distance, especially if you are the only one with lights.  As I look down the valley where I currently live I can easily make out a traffic signal many miles away due to the fact that there are no other lights around it. 

If you go into town avoid information leakage, do not say things like "we can always put that in the fridge" as it reveals that you have some method of refrigeration, often powered by electricity.  At night it may be wise to draw the shutters to avoid lights inside from revealing that you have any electricity.  If you speak by  radio to others it may be wise to always have the same person speak and never reveal how many people you have as someone could be listening and documenting your numbers.  Little things that infer your capabilities, weaknesses, or resources could be painting a target on you.  This would of course be a worst case scenario, but if you are a prepper that is what you are preparing for.

[Crappiewy]

Roadblocks are constitutionaly illegal in Wyoming.